Secrets

[Hockeyfan1852]

As you know secrets are an part of the game but there can be too much of a good thing. For example the map was racetrack and there was 11 players left and they were all in secrets. Having too many secrets on a map is not a good thing so this why I suggest no more than two secrets per map. Tell me what you think.

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-Hockeyfan1852​

 

[Damer_Flinn]

I suggest 0 secrets per map.

 

[Mevgin]

I suggest:
64x64x64 Map: 3 Secret
128x128x128 Map: 2 Secrets

 

[Hahaha00000]

I suggest:
64x64x64 Map: 3 Secret
128x128x128 Map: 2 Secrets

Why 3 secrets for a 64^3 map?

 

[Duffie]

Why 3 secrets for a 64^3 map?

Probably because it's smaller, and somewhat easier to find secrets.

 

[Mevgin]

Why 3 secrets for a 64^3 map?

Becuase its easier to find secrets on a small map. Just like Duffie said

 

[Hahaha00000]

Sounds logical enough :)

 

[Sploorky]

First off, I'm really not a fan of secrets at all. What I notice a fair bit are large secrets, or secrets with a maze, or etc etc. Basically, if you get there, you're usually set for the round. Those I don't like. What I don't find a problem with a small, basically 'glass cannon' secrets. It's a secret, yes, but if it's found, you're going to have no chance of surviving. Those I don't have a problem with. And of course, as long as the secret is fairly obvious and has some indication that the entrance may be there, not a case of "Put the secret entrance under this random block of grass in this large field of grass!" So I think the maximum amount of secrets a map should have should be dependent on the map itself, the quality of each secret, and how obvious the entrance of the secret is.

 

[ethical1337]

I agree with Damer on the no secrets on the maps. They were clever when they were first being implemented into maps. They would have only one or two, however with the removal of the 2x2x2 rule there are many many more hiding places to be found. I think we should even try for a while to have maps with NO secrets at all and simply make maps with more creative hiding spots available.

 

[karl_ravech]

I agree with Damer on the no secrets on the maps. They were clever when they were first being implemented into maps. They would have only one or two, however with the removal of the 2x2x2 rule there are many many more hiding places to be found. I think we should even try for a while to have maps with NO secrets at all and simply make maps with more creative hiding spots available.

I like how seriously people take their games of tag.

 

[ethical1337]

The second post was more on people getting really upset about a little detail of the game and were getting angry over it. This was a conversation on a (yes small) change for maps. However this one isn't in an upset tone or in any means going to make me feel the game is ruined if something is not changed.

My words will not be twisted against me!

 

[HadesHunter]

While I agree on both sides of the argument, and while I feel like some maps are spoiled with secrets but there should be some to keep the map more interesting (not that a lot of them need it) and skill-testing, I feel that if they were taken out completely, then the player-base would be split in two and cast into a grand argument. From my experience, (Mind you I haven't been on in a while, so it's just a lack of witnessing) this is the first time I've seen someone comment about secrets at all. While limiting them would be a good idea, and taking them out another, I feel that there should be a compromise. Mevgin and Sploorky have the right idea, but I have a little change to that idea:

In maps that are above 128x128x128, users are not allowed to put any secrets in. However, for maps below 128x128x128, users may put in only ONE secret. It must be cleverly disguised (as some were saying) but must also be able to be found by the semi-skilled eye, I.e; Not under a grass block in a field of grass (as was said previously as well).

In fact, I feel like there should be a little test for the general populace of Zombieland. There should be 2 maps made, a 256x256x256 with no secrets, and a 64x64x64 with one secret. Both those maps are queued up one after another, and then after both are played a vote would be cast to keep or discard the new rule.

What do you say?

 

[Nomasaurus]

My honest opinion is that it depends on the map. You can't just make a rule that correlates with map size, because the maps have become so diverse on blocktopia. You can have these huge 256x256x256 maps, that are relatively hard to survive on without secrets, or you can have a 64x64x64 that's easy to survive on. I agree that sometimes there are too many secrets, but I also feel like secrets are a reward for playing the game a while. Any one can be good at running, but if you're on the server for a long time then you find a secret and make it yours :D

 

[HadesHunter]

That's why people shouldn't place 3 secrets on a 64x64x64 map. It takes away from the... Delight of finding it. Think about this;

You are placed in a 128x128x128 map. Looks easy enough, nice and open, but some closed areas. However, you see zombies that are swarming people, trapping them easily enough. You look around, and see something off. You dig a bit, making sure to re-apply blocks behind you. You find it's a nice little secret area. You manage to survive to the 1 minute mark.

Then another map. Same thing, 128x128x128, zombies swarming.

Yet you find not one, not two, but three secret areas poorly disguised. You are found within the next 45 seconds.

Which situation would you rather be in? A or B? If you remain unconvinced, could we not just make a rule stating "Secret areas must be disguised to the best of your abilities, but must be able to be found by an acute eye." Would that be better?

 

[trngl3087]

 

[Vatumok]

Secrets are extremely bad for the gameplay, 1 secret is bad, 2 secrets are bad, 3 secrets are bad..... regardless of mapsize.
The whole concept of secrets is just bad, it requires no skill or creativity which are things I consider important if you want to survive. I mean, why is it good that people can survive by going to the exact same spot every time a map comes up?
I made it clear several times before that secrets are just generally bad, but they are not completely banned either. Maps with secrets can still be approved, of course, but I think that as of now I will take secrets more in account when adding new maps from the submission forum.

Briefly, secrets are bad so it's prefered that you have none but they are not banned.
See also: http://blocktopia.net/forum/threads/please-read-advice-on-making-maps.2888/

 

[Forseti]

I mean, why is it good that people can survive by going to the exact same spot every time a map comes up?

Just saying: I like going to the same, normal hiding spot when some maps come up, and I still win, just like in secrets x)

 

[ethical1337]

ya but you can also hide the same way but in a different spot. (side of a building, Above a doorway where people wont generally look) that sort of thing.

 

[Nomasaurus]

How about this. there are certain maps with their secrets, of course. But maps with too many secrets, or maps that should have secrets get rotated by ops. So when a new rotation comes up, the map with the AWESOME secret no longer has that secret in that place.... the entrance is in another place.. That would add to the delight of finding the secret, but keep the homey place of the secret! Therefore you could not forever camp one spot, but also secrets could not easily be ruined. Kind of rambled off there... but hope you guys got my basic idea? :)
For instance, racetrack. The secrets are blocked off/unblocked every time it appears in rotation. therefore you don't often see the same secret. Change it up a little?