PvE Base Raiding

Should base raiding be allowed in the PvE zone?


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Joel

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i've got a question for people who are against raiding in pve.

do you not want to raid yourself at all?
Not at all, like most people who are for it not being a thing, we want to PvE. We don't want to have to PvP if we don't want to, which is why we live in the PvE zone. It's honestly a huge false advertisement when you go "I'll just live in the PvE zone" and then someone comes and tries to steal your stuff every few hours. It is basically just forcing someone who wants to PvE into a pseudo PvP where they can't defend their selves and either get robbed or just have to sit and watch as someone they don't want around riffles through their things looking for stuff to take.
 

TechnoViking

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I honestly don't see a need for a rule that prevents raiding in PvE as raiders are already declawed. Invisibility potions are disabled, so are jumping potions and enderpearls. You also cant break or build, even if you repair/demolish afterwards, and use buckets of water in the same way. The only way to obtain invisibility is to switch and level a class for the purpose, in addition to removing your own equipment.

It is for these reasons I struggle to see the issue certain PvE players claim to be experiencing, as they are already informed of the danger and solution, yet refuse out of laziness, and then demanding the rules be changed to favor them even more. Stop expecting everyone to bend to your 'needs' when you already have the tools to fix the problem yourself.
I have been raided while adhering to the suggestions and rules, the raiding party seems to have been in the wrong but I have never been concisely informed of this. I have lost things to being raided like this which is unfortunate and an necessary evil with the system PvE raiders seem to love.

My struggle that I am experiencing is that I feel paranoid and stressed about the fact that I have to check my chests all the time in order to determine whether someone raided me or not, my next problem is also that I cannot allow anyone near or in my base since I have to be wary of people that want to raid me at any time since when they do find a way to do so there is nothing I'd be able to do against it.

Another solution I could offer is to allow people to at least kill players within view distance of their base in order to protect their base from possible raiders, that way as an PvE player you are at least able to defend yourself. I'm not a fan of this since it brings another shitstorm along but at least a PvE player would be able to protect himself.
 
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Araidian

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Personally I don't really like raiding, I much prefer just making cool bases and exploring.
Perhaps the town plugin could be modified so that each town inside the PVE zone has an area, and inside that area only town members can break and place blocks, and take items from chests and furnaces? That way, players who don't want to be raided and just build can do so.

Ideally maybe having 3 distinct areas could have been more beneficial - PVE, PVE with raiding, and PVP, though probably a bit too late for that.

Maybe another idea, is you can only steal items from chests in PVE if both your town and the town you are trying to take items from have some raiding option enabled? It would mean that you could only raid if you yourself can be raided.

Perhaps a combination of these could work, and I think having block protections on towns would be a good idea in general. Actually maybe a way to expand your territory using emeralds. Just some ideas
Actually very much in favor of a warring system where clans could declare war on each other and enable raiding on both sides.
It allows people who like the system to take part, and people who don't to sit out.
 

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Actually very much in favor of a warring system where clans could declare war on each other and enable raiding on both sides.
It allows people who like the system to take part, and people who don't to sit out.
Optional warring is 100% cool with me. With, of course, the condition that both parties have to agree to war (and this to be enforced by system, not a human).
 

Joel

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A Warning System is alright with me, the MAIN issue is not about having PvP or not. Its having an area where those that want only PvE can have that and people who want to enjoy raiding to do it, but on a system where the people who don't wanna join in don't have to and don't have to be annoyed by it when they are just trying to build a town and have fun. Its not fun for us to block our chests and have to be on guard and not be friendly to others because we can't trust anyone. Its just annoying and goes against the whole reason we are playing. To have fun with friends, meet new ones, and just enjoy a nice stress free little minecraft game. Which is why we picked the PvE area in the first place.
 

TechnoViking

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i've got a question for people who are against raiding in pve.

do you not want to raid yourself at all?
I do not wish to raid under the current system, I feel that it would take to much of me mentally trying to protect myself from any attempted counter attack and don't want to have to counter raid anyone ever again.

If the system where different from the current ruleset however I might consider it but I almost always tend to avoid any form of raiding in games where it is avoidable since I do not feel the need to steal from someone as I don't want to be stolen from.
 

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First I'd like to preface this with that I've skimmed most of the posts that reached a certain length, because quite frankly I couldn't be bothered to read it all, but they were also the posts that were pro removing raiding in PvE, or at the very least showed interest in the fact that things needed to be changed. However it's unfortunate that I can't really say the same about the other side, the people that do want to keep raiding in PvE. Most of those posts are only things like "put a block on it 4head" and things of similar nature. I honestly can't recall skimming over a post that actually explained why raiding should stay in PvE and not be just a comment where it's just pointing out that people that prefer no PvP interaction should just get used to it and take honestly dumb and counter intuitive measures to prevent people from doing such things.

Further I'm also noticing that there is an insanely large misconception by the people in this thread about what the issue here is, this could be because of the opening post, or for some other reason, I don't know. This thread wouldn't have existed in the first place if people kept playing by the rules. The first post was made because people didn't play by the rules. We knew what we got ourselves into when we joined the server, we knew very well that chests that could be accessed by people were free game. If we left the door open and someone raided us, dumb mistake from us and obviously it's our fault. But if the room is locked, and people break into it by breaking the rules and due to that our fun is ruined for a day straight, that's just not okay. Props to the administrative team for taking their time and thoroughly investigating the matter, but quite frankly it shouldn't have been a thing in the first place. If the aforementioned incident had never occurred and everyone would always play by the rules and colour within the lines, I don't think there ever would've been an issue, but evidently it appears not possible.

That's why this whole ordeal has become such an issue. It's not that we got raided, it's that it was done illegally and because of that it was practically impossible for us to play for an entire day. So you can say "put a block on it 4head" all you want, but if they broke blocks to get into the base in the first place, what would have a couple more blocks have done? As you can probably guess, nothing at all. So please, come up with a better solution than "put blocks on it".

Now as a solution for this whole ordeal, the best one I've spotted is probably the option where you can choose to opt into allowing raiding. This gives the people that prefer PvE but still want a bit of the thrill what they want, but it also gives the people that just want to build and have fun with their friends an opportunity to have their own fun. For the PvP people, I find it hard to understand why you simply wouldn't move to a dedicated PvP server. Everyone on there is there for the PvP, go raid their bases and slaughter them all you want, they singed up for it, but as the poll shows, a lot of the PvE people aren't signing up for the PvP interaction that is raiding. It's extremely shallow to ask people that joined for the PvE aspects of this server to have to take all the PvP with it, then you're better of just flagging the server as PvP only, because evidently that's just what is then. The PvE tag would be all for show and it would mean nothing.

Anyway these are just my 2 cents.


P.s.

Does this sound familiar? "just block your chests 4head"

 
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Hockeyfan1852

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SMP's have historically always allowed stealing if you have your chest uncovered.
I have not played on previous SMP's but I've seen that these previous SMP's are no longer running, I'm not saying that it was because of the chest locking rules but I do not think SMP's that are dead are an good example for a server we rather not have dead. I'd love to hear from older players on this server what did work though and why it worked so well like that, currently we are just a few days into this new launch and things already went wrong.
Here is a quote from Danni a couple of years ago when we had basicially a 100% pve smp with dungeons.
"He may either be referring to town protection, or maybe the thing that way too many clans go this way.
Founded>Having fun>trying to get a rank>gets rank>is happy for a bit>inactive."

We can't make the same mistakes as the past having the server go in this direction. There needs to be some spice for players to keep playing. Once you have finished your town in the pve zone that is free of any threat. You finish the questline complete the dungeon content and then what? I know most DoD players are satisfied with the server set up even though there is a half pve instead of full map pvp. Thought I would give my two cents on the matter.
 
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Unusual_Dood

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First I'd like to preface this with that I've skimmed most of the posts that reached a certain length, because quite frankly I couldn't be bothered to read it all, but they were also the posts that were pro removing raiding in PvE, or at the very least showed interest in the fact that things needed to be changed. However it's unfortunate that I can't really say the same about the other side, the people that do want to keep raiding in PvP. Most of those posts are only things like "put a block on it 4head" and things of similar nature. I honestly can't recall skimming over a post that actually explained why raiding should stay in PvE and not be just a comment where it's just pointing out that people that prefer no PvP interaction should just get used to it and take honestly dumb and counter intuitive measures to prevent people from doing such things.
At least for me the reason why I want raiding to stay in PvE is because making PvE a fully safe zone will make everyone want to live there, both people who wants to raid and to play a safe smp. While many easily could think that PvP-ers could raid and fight eachothers in the PvP zone, they still want to keep their bases and items fully safe which will mean they will stay in the PvE zone instead. Basically I believe restricting raiding in PvE will also restrict the raiding considerable in general. Both last smps died quickly after the raiding got restricted and prevented so I find it reasonable to believe that will happen again.
 

Chakabrah

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We can't make the same mistakes as the past having the server go in this direction. There needs to be some spice for players to keep playing. Once you have finished your town in the pve zone that is free of any threat. You finish the questline complete the dungeon content and then what?
To be fair, what do you expect when you basically make a game inside a game? If you want a minecraft server to keep running, you'll need to have expansive progression and more content anyways. If it's always just more of the same, which people will feel like in either of the 2 raiding situations, the server will die. Making it so that new players get pounded day one by experienced players in the PvE zone and then leave ain't gonna help either.
If you have a good server that's being kept up to date, with good admins who communicate well, the server won't die.

People who don't care about PvP shouldn't have to deal with player enemy's in a PvE area. Period.
Edit: I haven't read the rules, which I will soon. But it's a PvE zone, so isn't it fair assumption that people are not allowed to steal from anyones chests regardless of locks? Unless it's specified ofcourse.

Fix for this: lock command in PvE area's or a seperate world/dimension for PvE and one for PvP.



This is just my uneducated opinion though.
 
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Hockeyfan1852

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To be fair, what do you expect when you basically make a game inside a game? If you want a minecraft server to keep running, you'll need to have expansive progression and more content anyways. If it's always just more of the same, which people will feel like in either of the 2 raiding situations, the server will die. Making it so that new players get pounded day one by experienced players in the PvE zone and then leave ain't gonna help either.

People who don't care about PvP shouldn't have to deal with player enemy's in a PvE area. Period.
Edit: I haven't read the rules, which I will soon. But it's a PvE zone, so isn't it fair assumption that people are not allowed to steal from anyones chests regardless of locks? Unless it's specified ofcourse.

Fix for this: lock command in PvE area's or a seperate world/dimension for PvE and one for PvP.



This is just my uneducated opinion though.
You say that either of the 2 raiding situations will make the server die yet both situations can be prevented. There isn't a bot walking into your town and taking stuff from your unblocked chests everytime. You already proved that the raiding can be prevented by blocking doorways into houses and there was minimal/no stealing.
If you have a good server that's being kept up to date, with good admins who communicate well, the server won't die.
This is a given for any server doesn't really have anything to do with chest rules.
Fix for this: lock command in PvE area's or a seperate world/dimension for PvE and one for PvP.
There is already a way to lock your chest and the other idea splitting the playerbase will just make both servers die faster.
Edit: I haven't read the rules, which I will soon.
I'd advise you to read the rules before making a post or playing on a server so you have an understanding of how the server works.
 
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Kagamiiragi

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Here is a quote from Danni a couple of years ago when we had basicially a 100% pve smp with dungeons.
"He may either be referring to town protection, or maybe the thing that way too many clans go this way.
Founded>Having fun>trying to get a rank>gets rank>is happy for a bit>inactive."

We can't make the same mistakes as the past having the server go in this direction. There needs to be some spice for players to keep playing. Once you have finished your town in the pve zone that is free of any threat. You finish the questline complete the dungeon content and then what? I know most DoD players are satisfied with the server set up even though there is a half pve instead of full map pvp. Thought I would give my two cents on the matter.
Maybe with more development time there could be a capture the flag minigame within the PvP area where you get resources for every hour that you have the flag in a PvP base, and people try to steal it from eachother constantly? You get the safety of PvE whenever you want, and the challenge of making and defending your PvP base as well.

I'm sure there are more things that could be done in the PvP area that people can opt into from time to time to keep it fresh and fun.
 

Refrigerated_Elements

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At first I was very certain about my stance on allowing raiding in the PvE zone because I do not not the idea of not being able to retaliate much if I got raided by someone who lives in PvE and how easy it can be to put blocks over chests. However after seeing the extent that some people are being camped and not being able to do anything about it has made me doubt whether people should be able to raid in the PVE.

As of now I would like either restrictions on PVE raiding such as limiting camping and how much a person and/or clan can come to raid a given base. or the complete banning of PVE raiding.
 
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Chakabrah

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You say that either of the 2 raiding situations will make the server die yet both situations can be prevented.
You've misread. I mean that when that is your only, or when you only have a few feature(s), the server might very well die. That's why it is good to have these conversations and to keep innovating/expanding content wise. Like they do with the dungeons update.
There isn't a bot walking into your town and taking stuff from your unblocked chests everytime.
Isn't there though? Any passerby can try it and anyone who feels like it can too. So it's not like you don't have to be worrying about that every time you open and close a chest. To me it's just a very tedious and (administratively) lazy fix to a simple problem.
You already proved that the raiding can be prevented by blocking doorways into houses and there was minimal/no stealing.
Have I? Can't remember. And why do I have to grief myself into my own base or wait for someone else to open the door every time I want to enter it? It's not like you can use pressure pads, wires or switches to keep people out. And blocking every room with a chest in it is even more tedious.
There is already a way to lock your chest and the other idea splitting the playerbase will just make both servers die faster.
Isn't having both a PvP and a PvE area already splitting the playerbase though? I mean look at the discussion it's already bringing about? And I honestly think you can make it work when you make sure the PvE and the PvP environment need each other. For example: In PvP you can't mine resources but win currency/gear and have to buy resources/gear/ammo/potions from PvE and in PvE there should be no way to earn currency except through trading and currency needs to have a purpose like bounties. (I'm not saying we need to do this, but hey admins: If it's thought out better it might be very cool.)
I'd advise you to read the rules before making a post or playing on a server so you have an understanding of how the server works.
In the meantime I have read the rules and can honestly say I understand most arguements being made and the confusions/frustrations. I would like to note that I didn't go in completely blind, as I did hear some of the rules from my buddies at Bonfire. And no: I won't side 100% with the opinions of Bonfire, but I am a member of Bonfire therefore I am biased.
 
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KNBrisson

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So I had to create a forum account just to add my opinion because I'm an absolute darling and feel like I can throw in my two cents, though not like I should at this point.

So we're split into two groups, those for PvE raiding and those against it, And both sides have made valid points. Camping and sneaking into bases is a serious problem, And there's no counterplay to it whatsoever. However, blocking your chests may look ugly but it gets the job done.

Personally, I'm not a fan of the ability to run into the PvP zone from the PvE area and do a fair share of raiding, but given that we're quite literally having a contest to build the best walls, maybe it can be overlooked.

I propose that if somebody were to follow through with the above, (entering the PvP zone to raid and then fleeing it To their base in the PvE area of the map.) They are free game for a raid attempt in retaliation, but otherwise, PvE raiding should likely be banned.

And of course it's hard to moderate what a "single raid attempt" might look like, "what happens if I'm unable to score loot?" "Can I troll the player?" But we have to find some sort of a middle ground, rather than just saying yes or no, and that's gonna take work.
 
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Rune

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Yet another naysayer who doesn't even take the time to read the arguments or discussion and just replies with "just put a block on it".
Or because it's common advice but you're refusing it because it looks ugly lol. It's literally the easiest fix
 

Chakabrah

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Or because it's common advice but you're refusing it because it looks ugly lol. It's literally the easiest fix
It is indeed for moderators/admins the easiest fix. For players howevers it's the easiest to accidentally forget.