CAPITALISM MAFIA

Discussion in 'Archived Games' started by Jivvi, Dec 15, 2017.

  1. Iggish

    Iggish Member

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    I meant to say remember instead of mention here anyway.
    Fair enough, although can you understand why I think it is scummy?
     
  2. Danni122112

    Danni122112 The Drunk

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    thank you for you for the relevant and useful points you brought to the discussion
     
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  3. Danni122112

    Danni122112 The Drunk

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    on a more serious note, notty has been extremely busy this last week, so I doubt they have read everything here or got a good overview of things.
     
  4. Nottykitten

    Nottykitten Nomnomnom kitteh!

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    Would you rather have a bigger post

    I read practically everything except for when iggish started making big posts about rune without rune posting in between I kinda skipped those since they were essentially pointless and kind of annoying
     
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  5. Iggish

    Iggish Member

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    I can't find this conversation at all. Where did you make big posts?
    I'm guessing you mean your large post with the bolded numbers but under that I can't see any conversation relating to that.
     
  6. HKCaper

    HKCaper Almighty Mod

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    That is sort of what I meant with 'mistakes' (if this can clear that up a bit more). I DO understand why you think is scummy, because I think I know how you read his message. You probably felt the 'ill stick to my word' was unnecesairy and out of place, because you probably read it more as 'this is my claim, and ill keep this as my claim in the future' (it's hard to describe) instead of 'i said before i'd claim, so ill do that now'. My point was that I interpret the same message in a different way, HENCE not thinking it is scummy. Does that make sense?
     
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  7. Iggish

    Iggish Member

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    Well, except for the fact that it is the keystone for my suspicion of Rune but yeah, whatever. Idk how it's "pointless".
     
  8. HKCaper

    HKCaper Almighty Mod

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    Oops ye it was just 1 post, my bad

    Also, it was litterally one of the posts from Inffy soon after that, and then a single reply from my side. It's not that hard to find?
     
  9. Iggish

    Iggish Member

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    Oh, ok. Yeah, from your perspective, that clears it up as you had a stronger memory in your head that what it realistically was. This could also have been the case with Rune. He might've thought that it sounded more like a promise then it did as well.
    I still think the wording and the inclusion isn't innocent but I can understand why he said what he said.
     
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  10. Infected_alien8_

    Infected_alien8_ Garry's Mod Admin Mafia Host

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    webpaige HKCaper @anyoneelse

    Ok so I put the rune situation into a condensing machine and tried to make the shortest summary possible whilst paying homage to the main points brought up about him.


    MAIN ARGUMENT - Rune jumped on Iggish for a made up reason, consistently fails to sufficiently rationalise why he was suspicious of Iggish, backed down on Iggish when me and notty backed down

    - I asked Iggish about him randomly bringing up canada since I thought that was weird

    - Notty pushed hard on Iggish for the canada incident (basically Iggish said some stuff about why canada should be in the setup and it seemed contradictory at the time but he cleared it up)

    - Rune then randomly said Iggish was being vocal, trying to push for lynches and lead town, playing the same as last game (when he was scum). He said Iggish was the most suspicious because of this, but also said we should focus on lynching other people, because he thought Iggish was Irish in the game and said it was likely that Mafia were in US

    - I disagreed that Iggish was playing the same as last game

    - Notty asked rune why he wasn't voting Iggish

    - Rune said it was because he agreed with me that Iggish wasn't acting the same as last game (contradiction) and that the suspicion he had was only on his playstyle, which could be just how Iggish plays as a townie too

    - Notty backed down on Iggish

    - Rune backed down and apologised to Iggish

    - Me and Iggish asked Rune about where Iggish was supposedly 'leading town and pushing for lynches' and he kept avoiding the question by answering with an irrelevant responses that were pointing to different points in time and different behaviours e.g. (these aren't actual quotes, just made up to give a general idea of what the conversations were like) "when was he leading lynches" "he was being reactive after you said he was being reactive" "but rune when was he leading lynches like you said he was" "his playstyle was similar to last game, that's my interpretation" "but rune, where was he leading lynches" etc. etc. etc.

    - Eventually after ignoring the question for loads of pages whilst commenting on other things, he said that he thought Iggish's country diagram post about canada being a big country, and the fact that Iggish was so active early in the game, gave him the general impression that he was leading town/pushing for lynches (idk how he'd come to that conclusion but ok). He said it was probably his gut just being sensitive and paranoid and that he wasn't sure what his head was going through

    - Me and Iggish think that Rune tried to jump in on the bandwagon for a quick lynch, using a reason that wasn't rooted in reality, hence why he couldn't explain his argument or point to where Iggish was in fact doing what rune said he was doing, and why he backed down when I disagreed with him and when Notty backed down

    I think that's pretty much it? Any questions?

    To be honest, reading back over the original incident, I thought Rune was advocating for Iggish being suspicious for a lot longer than he actually was. In reality it was like 3 posts, in which he actually says we shouldn't focus on him (which I forgot about until now), then he became unsure about Iggish and "im probably just being paranoid" right after I said that I disagreed that Iggish was acting the same way. And reading back over all of Rune's posts, maybe I'm just getting paranoid and so second guessing myself, but I could kinda see him as just this confused, scatter-brained townie, like when he thought Iggish was in Ireland. However, he's still the most suspicious player imo. He still made up a point about Iggish and beated around the bush for ages when responding to it, which could just be a scatter-brained townie, but he's also done/been involved in other scummy things, including:


    SIDE ARGUMENTS - Aqua-rune interaction, Rune comparing himself to others weirdly, lots of resistance to lynching rune in the form of silence/refusal to vote, people voting him seem town to me (this point's more personal), weird excuse for his country claim being so late, voted aqua very late and without a proper reason, isn't scumhunting)

    - Aqua's interaction with rune - why did aqua not try to bus rune, who was basically the only other person capable of being lynched that day? Aqua was godfather, if he just survived that one day he would've probably been investigated and proven and clear for the rest of the game. The only reason I can see him refusing to jump onto rune is that rune was his mafia partner. It's also possible that Aqua did this to make rune suspicious though.

    - Rune keeps comparing himself to other people all the time, "inf did this so i did it too", "people donlt think this, so why are you saying this" (not actual quotes), etc. Seems like his mind is geared towards fitting in and noticing when he (and others) aren't, which suggests mafia mindset

    - Lynching rune is proving to be very difficult and if he was town I think Mafia would gladly help us lynch off a townie, but they aren't (or don't seem to be at least), so either they're staying silent so they don't look guilty when we lynch rune and they want me and iggish to lead the lynch on our own and frame ourselves, or what I personally find much more likely, rune is one of their mafia buddies and they don't want to give him up so easily

    - A more personal reason, all the people voting rune right now are my town-reads

    - When me and Iggish pointed out how he might benefit from claiming canadian justin t-whatever, by waiting to make sure nobody claimed canadian (he claimed late) and then claiming it so that he could choose a fake politician and not be at risk of being cc'd, and also justin seems like a guy who would be townie apparently (idk him but to others he's apparently someone they think would be a town pr), Rune sayshe waited to claim his canada country because he wanted to see if anyone would CC justin, but we weren't claiming names so how would he have been able to cc them, there isn't only one canadian politician. Rune defends this by saying that we knew the game only had well-known politicians, and justin is the only well-known canadian politician, and so if someone else claimed canadian, he would CC, and if they weren't justin, it'd be obvious that they were mafia. But we didn't know that the politicians in the game were all well-known; we only knew 2 politicians at that point (vat and ltin, the n1 deaths)

    - He voted aqua late and without a reason, he just said "shitty responses" or something, but has yet to explain this

    - He isn't even scumhunting, but he's not the only one


    --------------

    So yeah, I think I covered just about everything there, hopefully this post wasn't too long-winded or dificult to understand. If anyone has any questions then just ask.

    If we're not happy to lynch Rune today then I propose an Oak lynch. Who's up for lynching Oak?

    I'll admit, reading back over Rune's stuff has made him fall from 90% scum to about 78%, but honestly that could just be because I'm tired, I could change my mind again tomorrow. He's still the most suspicious for me though, and so my vote remains.
     
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  11. Infected_alien8_

    Infected_alien8_ Garry's Mod Admin Mafia Host

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    (and here, by ignoring, I mean not even responding anymore)
     
  12. Infected_alien8_

    Infected_alien8_ Garry's Mod Admin Mafia Host

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    Also to clarify, he kept pointing to parts of the game after he accused Iggish, for the reasons of his accusation, which obviously doesn't make sense because rune isn't a psychic and can't see Iggish's future posts to accuse, which is why it seemed like he made it all up to get Iggish lynched and then couldn't come up with any Iggish post that fit the criterea of what Rune accused him of; leading town, being vocal and pushing for lynches.
     
  13. Infected_alien8_

    Infected_alien8_ Garry's Mod Admin Mafia Host

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    If anyone wants quotes, read this post. Otherwise just ignore it.

    Here's where Rune accuses Iggish.

    Here are all the responses from Rune asking 'where did Iggish take the lead'. Bear in mind that these are just his written responses; on more than one occasion he straight up ignored the question.

     
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  14. Infected_alien8_

    Infected_alien8_ Garry's Mod Admin Mafia Host

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    Here's my thoughts after doing this recap thing as well.

    After re-reading, I can see a bit more how this might have been just a scatter-brained rune. It's possible that when he was accusing Iggish, he worded it badly. Instead of saying, "he's playing like he did last game in some ways. And last game he tried to take the lead and people trusted him, so we should be on the look out for that.", he said "he's playing like the last game, where he was leading lynches" (paraphrased).

    That would kind of explain his weird responses, particuarly the one where he says "He could potentially do that, I was just describing what he was doing last game. What my real point was how his style is repeated in this game; which again you noticed yourself." (actual quote)

    It's also possible that when me and Iggish were asking where Iggish was leading lynches and stuff, Rune forgot about that ^ and thought we were asking him about his suspicion on Iggish building after he became reactive on page 9:

    Which is why he kept referring to this moment.

    However, he then later admits that he thinks the reason for him thinking Iggish was leading lynches was because of the graphs he made. So that goes against my earlier point in this post about him just wording it badly; it seems he admits that he did accuse Iggish of leading lynches. But at the same time, he also said that he wasn't sure what was going on in his mind and he seems unsure if this is genuinely what happened. So I guess it is still possible that it was all just him being scatter-brained and forgetful and confused. Something which I just couldn't wrap my head around or unsterand until reading back over everything with fresh eyes.

    That being said, Rune's still the most suspicious player alive right now imo. Oak comes in second.
     
  15. Ooglie101

    Ooglie101 The Local Cow

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    (again this particular mafia game seems x1000 more boring to me than literally any other game ever so cough i haven't paid attention cough BUT)

    why is oak a lynch candidate
     
  16. Oak Milk

    Oak Milk Kill Hungry Thirsty Dead Mafia Host

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    because i havent been talking
     
  17. Oak Milk

    Oak Milk Kill Hungry Thirsty Dead Mafia Host

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    okay no to be fair and not oversimplify it

    i had said very little so far, only asking at the beginning of this day why people were so suspicious of rune, when i was called out for not talking i mentioned the fact that no one had answered my question, of course i havent really read shit so apparently there are multiple posts that actually answered my question but never answered me specifically. So of course I appear to be supporting rune by ignoring the actual conversation thats going on.
     
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  18. Danni122112

    Danni122112 The Drunk

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    same to me, but got better day 2, hope it will get even better day 3
     
  19. Infected_alien8_

    Infected_alien8_ Garry's Mod Admin Mafia Host

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    Yeah this
     
  20. Ooglie101

    Ooglie101 The Local Cow

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    i mean you can say the exact same thing about me tho
    since i asked why weak was suspicious at the start (i mean i did read the reason and i think its garbagio) and didnt really comment about it after
     
  21. Danni122112

    Danni122112 The Drunk

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    Infected_alien8_
    I have split views on inactive people:
    On one hand, we might be lynching someone based on nothing, because they said nothing, and that is oviously really stupid.

    On the other hand, they are contributing nothing except making our population higher than mafia's.
    Other than that this also could be a free ride for mafia, with a really easy way to blend in, just keep you rmourth shut.

    Does the above sum up your thoughts too, and do you have anything more we should take into concideration about inactive people?

    I would honestly prefer to lynch someone else than some inactive people for the first reason, maybe tomorrow too? At least if we have storng supicions.
     
  22. Infected_alien8_

    Infected_alien8_ Garry's Mod Admin Mafia Host

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    Yeah but the difference is that Oak said that he wasn't speaking because his question wasn't answered even though it was, which made me think he was just trying to come up with an excuse to not participate in his lynching, which doesn't sound townie. But obviously it could just be that he didn't read the thread (but why did he feel sure about saying his question wasn't answered if he didn't read the thread, idk).
     
  23. Infected_alien8_

    Infected_alien8_ Garry's Mod Admin Mafia Host

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    Yeah I'd definitely rather lynch rune or someone where we have an actual reason to suspect them other than inactivity, but if not rune then we have to start looking elsewhere, and out of the active people, I don't have any suspicions, so my mind then moves to the inactive ones because it doesn't have much choice.
     
  24. Iggish

    Iggish Member

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    If a Rune lynch were to not go ahead and someone else was to get lynched, I couldn't see the point in lynching oak. Especially if the main reason is that he was supposedly defending Rune, who we have deemed not to lynch.
    I mean, if we decided not to lynch Rune, that would be because we decided that he is probably not a mafia and more likely a townie. So why would we then go on to lynch someone basically for the only reason that they supposedly defended someone that we now consider townie. I don't understand this. If Oak were mafia he probably would jump at the opportunity to lynch Rune, not try to get out of the lynch. If he was mafia why would he defend someone who we deemed to be town. And if we didn't deem Rune to be town, then why wouldn't we lynch him.
    Unless I've read something wrong, this doesn't make any sense to me.

    As to what I think of lynching someone namely based on inactivity. I think it's probable that there's at least one mafia lurking and not posting much. However, it would basically be a shot in the dark and more then likely, we'd end up lynching a town. I'd prefer to lynch someone who I think is suspicious like TWG, Notty or Hk but idk if others would go for that. If we were to vote based on inactivity however, I'd go for TWG because he's been inactive and a reason or two to be considered scum regardless of the inactivity as well.
    Of course, this is only really in the case of Rune not being lynched and I still think that that is the best option to go for.
     
  25. Infected_alien8_

    Infected_alien8_ Garry's Mod Admin Mafia Host

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    Because it's entirely possible that the reason Oak refused to take part in the Rune lynch was because he knows that rune's town because he's Mafia and didn't want to look in on the lynch. Avoiding discussion isn't a townie thing to do in my eyes, so whatever Rune's allignment is, I can't help but think of scummy reasons to do it.
     
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