A rant that will be hated.

Xfolo

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I can't stand it. I have to speak up, as much as this will get hated but... What other chance is there?

Mines were one of the new additions to PTNT. At first they were fun to have about occasionally but now they are overused. God. I can barely go 10 blocks without someones bloomin' mine killing me. They are spammed about the map, and basically just ruin all the fun in PTNT. You might aswell rename the server Mine Wars instead of TNT wars because i get more mine kills than TNT kills. Or anything else for that matter.

Something needs to be done about all these mines. What's the point of trying to enjoy this if all i ever get is mine kills? This post will get disliked, but just my opinion.
 

digi

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I understand your frustration.
My confliction with this is, I often count on mines because I'm a horrible aim with a bow. Although TNT takes mere seconds to explode, there's still time for the enemy to escape. The lightning block does not work sometimes and it takes a few grenades to kill an enemy. Mines are insta-kill effective, and though I don't like them killing me, I rely heavily on them when I'm trying to gain points.

By the way, this sounds like a legit issue. I don't see why you should be put down for a point of view that probably most have experienced.
 

Notme

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Ummm mines are my working tactics. My KDR is increasing, when I use them.
I also sometimes die a lot due to mines, but I like them.
Also they were from start of PTNT. Also they were in Classic TNT.
Oh. But they were less spammed there.
Well, they are spammed, because people have more points than at beginning. I have now over 8000 of them.
 

Xfolo

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Ummm mines are my working tactics. My KDR is increasing, when I use them.
I also sometimes die a lot due to mines, but I like them.
Also they were from start of PTNT. Also they were in Classic TNT.
Oh. But they were less spammed there.
Well, they are spammed, because people have more points than at beginning. I have now over 8000 of them.
And thats the point of the thread. It's more mine wars than TNT wars.
 

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I can't stand it. I have to speak up, as much as this will get hated but... What other chance is there?

Mines were one of the new additions to PTNT. At first they were fun to have about occasionally but now they are overused. God. I can barely go 10 blocks without someones bloomin' mine killing me. They are spammed about the map, and basically just ruin all the fun in PTNT. You might aswell rename the server Mine Wars instead of TNT wars because i get more mine kills than TNT kills. Or anything else for that matter.

Something needs to be done about all these mines. What's the point of trying to enjoy this if all i ever get is mine kills? This post will get disliked, but just my opinion.
This is why you buy wool cutters
 

Notme

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I can't stand it. I have to speak up, as much as this will get hated but... What other chance is there?

Mines were one of the new additions to PTNT. At first they were fun to have about occasionally but now they are overused. God. I can barely go 10 blocks without someones bloomin' mine killing me. They are spammed about the map, and basically just ruin all the fun in PTNT. You might aswell rename the server Mine Wars instead of TNT wars because i get more mine kills than TNT kills. Or anything else for that matter.

Something needs to be done about all these mines. What's the point of trying to enjoy this if all i ever get is mine kills? This post will get disliked, but just my opinion.
This is why you buy wool cutters
Well fists sometimes work to. But sometimes mines likes to explode in my face XD
 

Defiant_Blob

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Um, so the argument against this seems to be that people rely on them a lot.

That's exactly why they should be nerfed though. If someone relies on one weapon instead of having to vary their choices a lot to gain points, then it's probably overpowered.

For example, say in TF2, they upped the power of one class incredibly. Players would start switching to it, and any players who didn't would be dominated. They have to rely on choosing the class so that they could be on an equal playing ground with the rest of the players. It'd only be when they nerfed that class that balance would return and players wouldn't have to "rely" on the class anymore to survive.

The mines are probably in a similar situation. They're overpowered, but you'll still use them because if you don't you'll be left behind in the dust.

And basically the argument that mines aren't bad for the server because they help you out is really weak, sorry. That just seems like whining over your favorite weapon in TF2 being nerfed.
 

One one two

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I have a very easy time avoiding mines simply by predicting where people are going to place them. Ask yourself "is that a good spot for a mine?" when playing. If the answer is yes, chances are there will be a mine there. All you have to do to avoid the mine is look for alternative methods to get through and/or play it safely and difuse it.

Also: take wide turns at busy corners, check under stairs before going up, treat suspicion with caution, and don't fall for the same trick twice. Every now and then I'll be killed by a well-placed mine and will make a mental note of the spot for later.
 

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I'd just like to say, I don't see why this "rant" will be hated; even if it's not put in the best way, this topic seems to have turned into a legitimate balance discussion topic, and all the points are valid.

From what I'm hearing, maybe they should be nerfed, but I haven't particularly seen it first-hand, so I don't have much of an opinion on the matter.
 

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I have to agree with Xfolo actually... I used to love TNT Wars back in Classic, but now I don't really like it. Most probably because I'm more used to the Classic weapons where you place a block and then it launches at the target, but I also find it that the fun of blowing people up is taken out because... I really don't know where would mines be placed. They're just... Unexpected.

Although, I barely ever step on mines because usually whenever I come on there's barely any people, it's wtill annoying.

Also, I think it's okay to say your point of view. I said mine, and even though my suggestion got rejected, at least I tried :)
 
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JKangaroo

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((I really wish there was a skeptical rating for this but....))

I don't believe you can truly say you can "spam" mines per se.
Because really, its not entirely something you CAN spam, like grenades that can be spammed multiple times at opponents.
Mines have been and really have remained purely a tactical and fairly limited item in most cases, because really, mines aren't all that useful in any gamemode outside of Capture the Flag (CTF), and normally Payload.
In fact, if one want's to say to limit the spamming of mines, can we also have the discussion of limiting the spam of lightning or grenades or bows and arrow-spam. (no, don't have those discussions) I've seen "sword" spam constantly, and that happened to be a major problem on the Floating ruins map because that was pretty much the best tactic for that map as well as others.

Its not the spamming of mines that's really the problem in what I see, rather, how they are used primarily on specific maps, (which is also a fairly major factor when seeing this "Mine" spam, because some maps discourage that).

The only time I've ever had "Mine" problem in my opinion has to be something like the map (is it?) Egypt, where I see MANY people purely using mines throughout the games to rack up kills along the jump-pads, because hey, people are going to HAVE to use those jumppads to get back onto the KOTH point.
So far, from my experience on PTNT, this has been the only map I've had a problem with mines.

Any other time however, Mines are a purely Tactical weapon which I have seen, used to either block oncoming marauders from the enemy team, create choke-points in which enemies either have to fight through or find a way to go around it (which is normally open), or even stopping a flag-carrier from reaching the flag by a well placed mine.
Using map knowledge and experience, one can use mines as an effective weapon.

However...
I think, I can partially agree with Stieb here (only partially because I don't actually know the problem but...), as
Mine radius actually...
Is really really wonky.
I've been able to stay out of the target radius for a mine in which it can go off and even when I try to break it with my Wool Cutters, it still easily goess off, killing me in the process.
And yet, sometimes, I am able to see players go practically maybe, 2 blocks from the mine and are able to cut it before it goes off, which baffles me.
I've also had cases where I am able to land or run into an enemy mind and have it not blow up on me, which shouldn't work.

That's the only problem with mines for me.

I find that saying if its "spam" or not could depend on your tolerance level of others using the mine and how many times you as a person die from it instead.
Because, as a player, a mine is essentially used just as much as every other tool in the arsenal that one has on TNT Wars, using Mines on CTF maps to create chokepoints and denying specific routes, to bows to possibly slow down retreating enemies, TNT as a normal "control" weapon, etc etc etc, and the list can go on.

Personally, I have a extremely low tolerance for grenades, and find they are spammed against me in huge degrees whenever I play and it tends to make my experience un-enjoyable, and I can't handle that, however I tend to have a fairly high tolerance for mines, however, for both situations, I can normally understand why they are being used at said time and place because well....

Its a weapon.
Its an easy-to-use weapon, just like bows and grenades and lightning and swords and what-not.
People are obviously going to use it because it is available to them like all the other weapons.
Of course people are going to say its a weapon some people rely on because well...

You basically rely on every weapon in your arsenal, don't you?
Because, that's how I see most people play.
...
Eh--- thats just my opinion.

I don't really think mines need to be nerfed.
But, I just think the radius could use some refining :x
There no real reason "Why" they should be nerfed from what I have seen, experienced, and really there hasn't been a good reason in this thread yet that I've seen to nerf it exactly...
...
But neither is there a real reason not to either.
It's---- more like its in a neutral state which doesn't really need to be changed in my opinion.
That's about it really.
 

0x3c0

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Although the delivery's not great, (rants are rarely productive because they often don't offer a reasonable solution) the point is fair.

JKangaroo, I agree for the most part but the main issue that the OP is trying to bring out is that people aren't relying on every weapon in their arsenal, just placing mines. They can be used strategically, and I like that because it makes me think instead of charging in. However, they can also be used with a smaller measure of skill than say, a bow. Another weapon being equally frustrating isn't necessarily a reason to ignore a potential problem.

I'm mostly neutral (leaning slightly in favour of reducing the radius) on the matter, but agree with Defiant_Blob - if mines need to be balanced, they shouldn't be passed over because a lot of people use them. If they're unbalanced and a lot of people use them, that's even more of a reason to balance them!

Just for the record: a mine in PTNT isn't exactly the same as a mine in CTNT - it's actually a slightly nerfed version of a proximity mine (an upgrade). Although the Classic mines may have suffered from a similar issue, the price of the upgrade would have made any issues far less noticeable.
 

ethical1337

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I personally have thought about the mine a lot. I have also found the most useful maps for mines are CTF maps. As well as the egypt KOTH map.

I was thinking perhaps having mines detonate when the person who placed them gets too near as well. I feel that is something that would have a sort of fair debuff to them.

They can be placed to block a path from an enemy but it also blocks you. You couldn't then just place them all around a flag area or capture point and then be stepping right on it yourself to defend/capture the point.

I also do not know if it is code-able but I was thinking of something like if the explosion radius could change depending on how many blocks it was going through or what type of blocks. Say the mine is exploding from behind 2 blocks of stone. The radius or damage taken from the mine perhaps shouldn't insta kill the player but do substantial damage. Then if its through like glass or water than it would kill you from that range.

Or perhaps just reducing the range in which the explosion would affect. the range in which the mine is triggered seems fine to me. I have never had an issue punching a mine to disarm it other than if its at an odd angle from where I'm standing.

However as OOT said you start to learn where mines are effective in a map and start to avoid or take caution around those areas. I do find the occasional mine to be aggravating but then most of the time its you own impatience to get back into the fight that gets you killed.

however so sparkly sees this. :3 SparklyMuffinz
 

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Mines don't bother me at all. What bothers ME is when the opposing team won't let you leave your spawn without being killed, or when you're the only one on your team online, such as Blue has 1, Red has 4, and you're just asking for someone to come over evenly, and they just continue killing you, not even bothering to help.
 

hihihilolHI

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Mines don't bother me at all. What bothers ME is when the opposing team won't let you leave your spawn without being killed, or when you're the only one on your team online, such as Blue has 1, Red has 4, and you're just asking for someone to come over evenly, and they just continue killing you, not even bothering to help.
Both of those would be problems for the staff to deal with, since they all violate the rules. You could just ping someone ;)
 
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Awwwyea

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I still have Vietnam-style flashbacks from Classic TNT's mines, thanks thread.Txboy1234

I have to agree with Defiant here. This does kind of remind me of how difficult a store idea would be to implement into Zombies, because items need to have their drawbacks. Same here, since not everyone will be professional and paranoid about being blown up wherever they walk. Personally, I can just imagine a character snooping around with bloodshot eyes picking up rocks so he can move forward one step, sipping an espresso to keep himself on edge. ;)