Other Where We Are, Moving Forward, and an Apology

[Nillbugwtw]

I'm going to address the topics in the title a bit out of order, as I'd like to start with an apology to the community.

Admittedly much of this mess the community finds itself in is due to my own negligence and lack of activity, and I'd like to personally apologize for that - now more than ever, when admin leadership is necessary to the survival of the community, I've been more detached than ever, with no legitimate reason behind my disconnect. I'd very much like to see this community turn around, and I'm now fully committed to making that happen.

That's not something that can be done alone - as a community, we need to be ready for change, as moderators and administrators, we need to be ready to make tough decisions. I'm pleased to announce that we have a couple new promotees who will help in reviving portions of the community.

First, with Superstein being on leave, Psycho has been promoted to Admin - he has some great ideas for the future of the community, and I'm happy to have him on the team with me.
Second, Lee_scar has been promoted to Server Admin of Kami's Realm, following the void left by the resignation of its former heads (admittedly, several months ago). Lee is already fixing some of KR's key flaws, and has also been brainstorming excellent ideas for other event servers.
Please welcome them both to the team!

Now, it's no secret that playercount on our servers is at an all-time low, and head staff aren't plugging our ears and trying to ignore the problem (nor would we like the community to do so). That being said, there is a fine line between pointing out shortcomings in the community vs circlejerking, between critiquing and criticizing. I would ask that, as a community, we focus our efforts into the former, instead of delving into the deep end of the latter. Certainly, a functioning community is necessary to draw more players to our community, but a forum full of "community is dying nazi admins" will only serve to push potential users away.

Speaking of pushing users away, I'd like to briefly comment on the harassment of other community members, and make it abundantly clear that in no way, shape, or form are personal attacks tolerated in this community. Much of this toxic attitude has been brushed aside or ignored for too long, and as a result the infraction system will be making a comeback to deal with such posts.

Any personal attack on another user within the community will net you 5 infraction points, with a PM explaining the staff member that assigned the infraction and the post that caused the infraction. A personal attack that is discriminatory (including but not limited to sexism, racism, and homophobia) will net you 14 points. These are appealable, if you feel that the infraction was given unfairly, you may send a PM to the Community Admins, who will discuss the infraction in the conversation with you and make a final decision on it. Once reaching a 15 point threshold, a 1 week ban will be automatically administered, at 20 points, a non-appealable permanent ban will be automatically administered. I'll make a full post in a separate thread about this topic later. Note that while these new infraction rules are not retroactive, past behaviour will factor into the decision of appeals.

Finally, we get to the topic of moving forward. There have been a lot of strong opinions on this subject lately, and I'd like to thank everyone for their honesty - these are difficult decisions, and I would like everyone to have their fair say in them. First and foremost, at the current time, I don't feel that axing all of our servers is the best move for the community. That's not to say that in the future, we may move to a general gaming community that does not host (permanent) servers, but in our current state, I favor trimming down our lineup as opposed to cutting it completely. No final decisions have been made yet, but expect to hear some news in the coming week or two, after the Admin team gets a chance to talk about it.

We have also been discussing shifting efforts to hosting more event servers, that would run for anywhere from a single weekend to a few weeks, and several plans are already in the works - I don't want to spoil much, but expect to see both old and new event servers very soon! I'm also putting together some movie night options (and taking suggestions!), so expect those in the near future.

Again, I'd like to apologize for my disappearance, thank you for your community suggestions, and say, that frankly, while we have a lot of work ahead of us, I'm excited for the community's future.

Feel free to post any questions or concerns that you have in this thread - I know you all are full of opinions, and I'd love to hear them.

Nillbugwtw

 

[Marlem]

What about all the swearing from staff I've supposedly been hearing about? I don't have any examples but I'm pretty sure other people can give some.

 

[paceboys]

Lee is already fixing some of KR's key flaws

How do you fix the flaw of not having players who want to play? I get that he's fixing flaws which is great, but I don't think making raiding possible and balancing clan skill will make everyone flock back.

This goes for the other servers too, you can make them bug-free and work 100% as intended but how does that make people come back?

 

[Jayfeather]

What about all the swearing from staff I've supposedly been hearing about? I don't have any examples but I'm pretty sure other people can give some.

I can't imagine anyone fucking cares though

See how casually I just swore, it literally means fucking nothing, I'm not mad at you or at anything I was just using the fuckin' word like it IS true that the average age in the community has decreased but they are going to grow soon here and it's only a couple people talking about it in the first place.

Besides we need to break down the idea that staff are angels because no, they are people - players like everyone else and this is what causes the rift that staff are the holy beings and players need to strive to be a "perfect model" to become like staff (remember trusted rank? everyone coveted that and they changed their behaviors to match something silly so they would be chosen)

 

[Nillbugwtw]

What about all the swearing from staff I've supposedly been hearing about? I don't have any examples but I'm pretty sure other people can give some.

I'm not aware of anything significant - our policy has always been that swearing is acceptable, as long as it's in some degree of moderation and not directed towards another player in a harassing manner - if anyone has any examples that they feel break this policy, please bring them to my attention.

How do you fix the flaw of not having players who want to play? I get that he's fixing flaws which is great, but I don't think making raiding possible and balancing clan skill will make everyone flock back.

This goes for the other servers too, you can make them bug-free and work 100% as intended but how does that make people come back?

In KR's case (and really, the servers as a whole), the first step is fixing them. Many have been somewhat abandoned development-wise, and need significant fix-ups before they're playable. I agree with you, having working servers does not guarantee (or even result in) an influx of players, but is a necessary first step, while things like advertising are finally set up. For KR specifically, axing it is an option on the table, but Lee would like to at least try to fix it before getting rid of it.

 

[paceboys]

I can't imagine anyone fucking cares though

See how casually I just swore, it literally means fucking nothing, I'm not mad at you or at anything I was just using the fuckin' word like it IS true that the average age in the community has decreased but they are going to grow soon here and it's only a couple people talking about it in the first place.

Besides we need to break down the idea that staff are angels because no, they are people - players like everyone else and this is what causes the rift that staff are the holy beings and players need to strive to be a "perfect model" to become like staff (remember trusted rank? everyone coveted that and they changed their behaviors to match something silly so they would be chosen)

In KR's case (and really, the servers as a whole), the first step is fixing them. Many have been somewhat abandoned development-wise, and need significant fix-ups before they're playable. I agree with you, having working servers does not guarantee (or even result in) an influx of players, but is a necessary first step, while things like advertising are finally set up. For KR specifically, axing it is an option on the table, but Lee would like to at least try to fix it before getting rid of it.

Makes sense. One idea that I had was more events on it, in the server that I co-run we have weekly events for pvp protection area around player-made towns/items, with events like parkour/pvp/"5 minute build"/dungeon runs, which I think help attract people, at least on the weekends (we host on weekends).

 

[Arachadonic]

Have to say, its been really really tragic seeing the once amazing and game-changing "Blocktopia" slowly decay. I could go on but there isn't much point. Its good that this thread has been made though and at least an admin has addressed the concerns.

If I can say one thing it would be advertising. advertising. advertising. The forums (as regards their design) is one of the best and nicest I've seen and whats left of the community is always welcoming and up for fun yet there is no point really having good game servers (which imo they aren't up to the current standard) or a good forum if no one knows about it but hopefully that will change. Social networks are always a great way i.e instagram, fb, twitter etc.

Hopefully EscRestart can pull through :)

 

[Jayfeather]

If I can say one thing it would be advertising. advertising. advertising.

This especially. "It's harder than it looks" is a ludicrous answer at this stage in the game and that's all we've gotten for a year now

 

[Nillbugwtw]

This especially. "It's harder than it looks" is a ludicrous answer at this stage in the game and that's all we've gotten for a year now

I agree - I had a few unreleased advert projects in the works several months ago, and while they've since fallen flat, I'd like to get some advertising done in the coming month.

 

[paceboys]

I agree - I had a few unreleased advert projects in the works several months ago, and while they've since fallen flat, I'd like to get some advertising done in the coming month.

It's great that you want to advertise and I'm sure you've considered what I'm about to say, but isn't it better to focus on keeping our players in the community before trying to bring more in? Advertising is great but are we at a point where we can sustain more players?

 

[Arachadonic]

This especially. "It's harder than it looks" is a ludicrous answer at this stage in the game and that's all we've gotten for a year now

No offense to anyone but that kind of sounds like a cop out. There are so many free forms of advertising that if used correctly can be worth much more than paying for it e.g Youtube, Twitter, Facebook, voting sites etc...

I don't see how on earth it is that hard and if it is too hard for Admin to manage while they do whatever else they do, then have someone else completely dedicated to advertising just like companies have (a marketing director or whatever).

 

[Jayfeather]

It's great that you want to advertise and I'm sure you've considered what I'm about to say, but isn't it better to focus on keeping our players in the community before trying to bring more in? Advertising is great but are we at a point where we can sustain more players?

Any players still here are essentially retained considering we're at rock bottom

 

[Arachadonic]

It's great that you want to advertise and I'm sure you've considered what I'm about to say, but isn't it better to focus on keeping our players in the community before trying to bring more in? Advertising is great but are we at a point where we can sustain more players?

(sorry for double post - not sure how to merge with this quote) ninja'd
I agree. While advertising is a huge and key part to pumping more life back into the community, there is no point advertising a community which has lack-luster and somewhat generic game servers (more specifically Minecraft). So personally I think getting the house in shape first as regards development (which will mean the devs will have to push it), maybe bringing back re-vamped gamemodes and sorting out a staff issue which I've heard from some posts exists (?) should take priority before advertising.

All that said, while the developers are hard at work and the other staff are coming up with ideas etc. I think advertising should still be getting planned out e.g what forms, what social networks, who is in charge of what, do we have an artist, what comps we could run, rewards for voting etc.

 

[Nillbugwtw]

It's great that you want to advertise and I'm sure you've considered what I'm about to say, but isn't it better to focus on keeping our players in the community before trying to bring more in? Advertising is great but are we at a point where we can sustain more players?

Personally, I think we are - or at least, will be, in the coming month. Keeping current players, in my mind, entails having a non-toxic, happy community that enjoys spending time interacting with others on the forums as well as entertaining themselves on servers, the latter of which especially is certainly boosted by having others to play with. If we're not there yet, I feel that we can patch ourselves up to that standard relatively quickly, given that everyone is on board with that idea.

Beyond that, the first advertising run will largely be a test run to see what works and what doesn't - the costs will likely come out of my own pocket, and will be mostly a test of different avenues of advertising.

No offense to anyone but that kind of sounds like a cop out. There are so many free forms of advertising that if used correctly can be worth much more than paying for it e.g Youtube, Twitter, Facebook, voting sites etc...

I don't see how on earth it is that hard and if it is too hard for Admin to manage while they do whatever else they do, then have someone else completely dedicated to advertising just like companies have (a marketing director or whatever).

We have YouTube and Twitter accounts (though the latter is somewhat inactive). We've used voting sites in the past and are looking into the option of using them again. Facebook has, in my experience, been more beneficial connecting with current players instead of obtaining new ones.

I'm not one to talk about things that "take time", especially given the current thread, but like it or not, typically, the cheaper it is to advertise, the more time consuming it is. Administrators have to manage the community and spend a considerable amount of time doing so, entirely unpaid, while having an entire life outside EscR, often with university, jobs, etc. Companies do have marketing directors, hell, entire marketing teams, but remember, we are not a company. We make no extra money off the community, and can't just hire someone to manage our advertising campaigns.

I know that in the past we put together an advertising/design team, and Psycho has spearheaded the effort for quite some time now. If those people are still interested, I would love to get them involved in some upcoming campaigns.

 

[Enderfive]

I can't imagine anyone fucking cares though

See how casually I just swore, it literally means fucking nothing, I'm not mad at you or at anything I was just using the fuckin' word like it IS true that the average age in the community has decreased but they are going to grow soon here and it's only a couple people talking about it in the first place.

Besides we need to break down the idea that staff are angels because no, they are people - players like everyone else and this is what causes the rift that staff are the holy beings and players need to strive to be a "perfect model" to become like staff (remember trusted rank? everyone coveted that and they changed their behaviors to match something silly so they would be chosen)

I don't really personally care about the whole swearing thing. I swear myself from time to time, for emphasis or whatever the reason. Perhaps there is no reason, I just feel like putting it there; in any case, I'm not bothered by it.

But here's the thing: just because I'm not or you're not doesn't mean that no one is or that it's some age thing that those people will grow out of inevitably. And even if they would, they're still bothered by it now. I haven't witnessed any excessive swearing myself, but that's probably because I'm basically only active on the forums nowadays, and I have seen some people that really do feel like excessive swearing, from staff or players, is an issue. And when they feel like it's an issue, it becomes an issue, especially when we're supposed to be trying to be extra welcoming to new people and trying extra hard to keep the existing members here. If those people are bothered by it, they'll leave, and isn't that precisely what we're trying to avoid here?

I wouldn't ban swearing or try to enforce stricter policies on it than what we already have. Seems a bit excessive, and it would cause another backlash from people that like having the freedom to swear from time to time. But my point is, having a freedom to swear doesn't mean that you have to swear. Even if you're okay with swearing, then you can still think about whether it's really necessary to put that "fucking" out there, because there are some people that aren't okay with it. Sure, you can swear from time to time, but I don't think using those words as casually all the time is something that can create that friendly atmosphere that we're trying to achieve.

As for staff also being players, that's kind of invalid in my opinion. Yes, staff are players as well. That means that players should not be intimidated by staff, because they're people too. But staff are also role models, no matter how you look at it. They will always be seen as role models by the players. They're the ones representing the community. Encouraging staff to act in a way that can be uncomfortable for some players is encouraging the community to become uncomfortable for some players, which is not something that we should do in my opinion.

Also, not saying here that everyone and especially staff should stop swearing or reduce the amount of it. I'm just saying that I think it'd be great if we tried to be reasonable about it.


In any case, I'm glad to see Nill is trying to make things happen and I'm glad to see Psycho on the admin team. Hopefully the actions will yield results.

 

[parquette]

I can't imagine anyone fucking cares though

See how casually I just swore, it literally means fucking nothing, I'm not mad at you or at anything I was just using the fuckin' word like it IS true that the average age in the community has decreased but they are going to grow soon here and it's only a couple people talking about it in the first place.

Besides we need to break down the idea that staff are angels because no, they are people - players like everyone else and this is what causes the rift that staff are the holy beings and players need to strive to be a "perfect model" to become like staff (remember trusted rank? everyone coveted that and they changed their behaviors to match something silly so they would be chosen)

It sounds less friendly and even though it isn't directed towards anyone online, it still develops bad habits. I'm just saying that it doesn't make anyone better sounding, but it just makes them sound less friendly. Mainly it makes it hard to read the chat if you're someone who doesn't use or doesn't agree with using cuss words. Just sayin'... :)

And yes, the staff aren't angles, but we can still strive to do our best at being the most helpful and friendly while being around players :)

Those things about staff swearing towards players isn't quite right. It's just the context of it all. It is basically what I stated in the paragraphs above. I hope everyone understands.

 

[Naoh]

We have YouTube and Twitter accounts (though the latter is somewhat inactive). We've used voting sites in the past and are looking into the option of using them again. Facebook has, in my experience, been more beneficial connecting with current players instead of obtaining new ones.

What if there was a specific administrative position just for social media? Or a social media team? That way the big guys don't have to worry about that as much?

 

[JtTorso]

It sounds less friendly and even though it isn't directed towards anyone online, it still develops bad habits. I'm just saying that it doesn't make anyone better sounding, but it just makes them sound less friendly. Mainly it makes it hard to read the chat if you're someone who doesn't use or doesn't agree with using cuss words. Just sayin'... :)

And yes, the staff aren't angles, but we can still strive to do our best at being the most helpful and friendly while being around players :)

Those things about staff swearing towards players isn't quite right. It's just the context of it all. It is basically what I stated in the paragraphs above. I hope everyone understands.

I don't know about bad habits, but there is a time and place for everything and if you feel someone is taking things too far with their use of swearing then you are within your right to ask them to tone it down and they are within their right to refuse, I don't think that's the case it mostly sounds like you have a different belief system then most people here in the community and we are a moderately diverse community at that.

I've heard a theory that people will like an individual more if they use casual swears in a non direct or insulting way and I can see why but it ultimately comes down to the individual and how they choose to conduct themselves, but I think that's a different and unrelated discussion. I think forcing people not to swear (Not that I think you're suggesting that entirely) is simply unfair and unrealistic.

A lot of people seem to forget how we (Staff, at least in the case of Classic Zombies) did things, we used to ban people and give reasons like "fuck you" or "stay the fuck off the server" and that's just how we did things and no one had a problem with it, I'm probably guilty of doing it myself but I wouldn't even consider it now, it is absolutely an inappropriate thing to do.

 

[Friendy]

Personally, I think we are - or at least, will be, in the coming month. Keeping current players, in my mind, entails having a non-toxic, happy community that enjoys spending time interacting with others on the forums as well as entertaining themselves on servers, the latter of which especially is certainly boosted by having others to play with. If we're not there yet, I feel that we can patch ourselves up to that standard relatively quickly, given that everyone is on board with that idea.

I'd like the staff to review members of the community who are incredibly toxic to other members, the community does not need this kind of negativity.

 

[nitasu987]

The thing is for me, and I might get hate for this, but I know that so many people have left the community altogether due to disinterest or life stuff. I have BOTH of that, yet I still am here. I may not be into minecraft anymore, but I still care about the community and I still want to see it grow.


Now I also have an Idea that would be pretty cool but I don't know if it would necessarily work due to my lack of knowledge of the playerbase... Do we have enough people for a WoW Guild?? :)

 

[ReyvnNova]

Glad to hear there's some plan of action, it really makes me happy. I don't exactly hang out here much anymore, but it's been sad to see and hear the steady decline of a place I used to frequent basically every day.

If there's any help you need, just holla.

 

[Jayfeather]

Looking at this thread now I think I know what happened with the swearing thing

Likely nothing really got out of control, however this:

...I don't think that's the case it mostly sounds like you have a different belief system then most people here in the community and we are a moderately diverse community at that...

I believe got misconstrued in a telephone effect to mean:

What about all the swearing from staff I've supposedly been hearing about...

TL;DR There was somewhat noticeable outcry about this issue from specific individuals with strict codes they adhere to and someone heard their point of view and thought that swearing was a bigger issue than it actually was, hence why the debate even started

 

[superhalo6]

And yes, the staff aren't angles, but we can still strive to do our best at being the most helpful and friendly while being around players :)

Personally I'm acute.

 

[Vatumok]

There should not be stricter rules about swearing but hostiliy/general douchebaggery should be punished more harsly. Allowing swear words has always been around and gives us a mature reputation, being a dick gives off a bad reputation. I see a lot of edgy/harassing posts of long time members which is quite saddening.

Regarding advertising, I really think the servers should be in a better state so that people get interested when the see the advertisement and want to keep playing after hopping on the server.

Congratulations to Psycho and Lee_Scar

 

[S_swimmer]

Ok, this will probably coin some eye-rolls and sound overly repetitive, but I beg you, bring back AoD.

I think that getting AoD back has to do more with the actual developers of the server than yelling at the server admins, and I don't know who to talk to. I unfortunately can't do anything about developing and coding, but honestly, the ideas for AoD 2.0 were great and I will lead the way to get it back into our servers if I have to. I didn't realize how much it meant to me when it was still there, but I've lost most of my interest in minecraft and I will still come back for AoD.

I'd love to talk to the devs and/or admins about getting AoD back and I'll definitely help, but please bring it back i love it so (also sorry for the shitty post idk if this was confusing or not but I'm a bit tired)